Betting sites in New Zealand: operator profiles with the marketing stripped out (2026)

What You’ll Actually Discover in an Operator Profile

A genuine operator profile tells you who holds the licence, how long the site has been trading, and which studios supply its games. Many New Zealand punters focus on the size of a welcome offer, yet the real differentiators sit deeper: the availability of 24‑hour support, the number of withdrawal windows processed per day, and whether the live dealer tables stream from a dedicated studio or a shared feed. By reading a profile you learn whether the catalogue is refreshed monthly with new pokies releases, how many deposit methods carry zero fees, and whether the verification team requests documents within hours or days. These details shape your daily experience far more than a one‑time bonus ever could.

When you strip away the marketing, an operator profile should answer three core questions. First, who is legally responsible for the platform and where are they regulated? Second, what is the actual library size for the game type you play most, rather than a headline figure padded with demo titles? Third, how does the support roster behave at 3 a.m. on a Tuesday? The following sections unpack each of those questions across the ten operators listed in the comparison table, giving you a factual baseline before you deposit a single dollar. The scoring behind this order is explained in the best online casino NZ reviews page.

Operator Launch Dates and Catalogue Sizes at a Glance

Every operator profiled on this page has been accepting New Zealand players for at least two full calendar years, a threshold that weeds out fly‑by‑night launches. The earliest among them opened its virtual doors when mobile pokies were still a novelty; the most recent entered the market after the Department of Internal Affairs signalled the upcoming licensing regime. The table below summarises the approximate era in which each site launched and the general scope of its game lobby, drawn from public registry data and the operator’s own responsible‑gambling disclosures. A separate page, our video poker comparison, goes into this in detail.

Interpret these windows with care: a launch date alone says little about how a platform has evolved. Some operators that started small have tripled their lobby within two years, while others have kept a deliberately compact range to maintain faster compliance checks. The catalogue scale descriptors are editorial judgements based on publicly visible lobby counts, not verified audits. Before committing to any site, open its games tab and filter by your preferred provider to confirm the current depth meets your expectation. There is more on this in our wildz casino comparison.

Studio Line‑ups: What They Reveal About a Lobby

The studio roster is the single most telling page of any operator profile. A site that lists only three or four providers often relies on a white‑label package; one that names fifteen or more has actively negotiated direct integrations with independent developers. In New Zealand, the most commonly encountered studios include Evolution for live dealer tables, Pragmatic Play for high‑volatility pokies, and NetEnt for proven slot maths. When a profile mentions a bespoke partnership with a studio such as Microgaming or Play’n GO, it usually signals that the operator has invested in exclusive tables or custom bonus rounds you will not find elsewhere. For the neighbouring question, see the top online casinos NZ guide.

• Studios with a live‑casino focus bring dedicated studios, native‑speaking dealers and multiple camera angles.
• Providers that specialise in pokies typically refresh their catalogue monthly, so a lobby that shows last month’s releases is a sign of active maintenance.
• Game aggregators such as Relax Gaming or SoftSwiss often sit behind the scenes, connecting a single platform to dozens of smaller developers; this is why many sites list 50+ studios without a corresponding storage overhead.
• Exclusive titles, when genuinely in‑house, are usually marked with a “bespoke” or “operator exclusive” badge inside the game client.
• Open‑source build information in a site’s privacy policy or technical‑compliance page can confirm whether the operator uses a proprietary platform or a licensed white‑label solution.

None of the operators on this page restrict themselves to a single provider, but the weightings differ. A handful tilt heavily toward one studio’s portfolio, which can mean deeper integration but less variety; others spread their deal across fifteen or more partners, giving you greater choice but occasionally thinner customer support when a specific provider’s feed goes down. The comparison table at the top of this page groups operators by the breadth of their studio list, from tightly curated to industrially broad. The related figures are collected in the skycity online casino page.

Support Channels and the Response Times That Matter

When a withdrawal gets stuck or a two‑factor code fails, the distinction between live chat that answers in ninety seconds and an email ticket that waits eight hours becomes painfully clear. Every profiled operator offers at least two support channels, but the way they staff those channels differs. Some route live chat through a regional team that works New Zealand business hours; others use a follow‑the‑sun model, giving you 24‑hour English coverage at the cost of slightly longer initial verification steps. See our cosmo casino rundown for background on this topic.

Live Chat Response Windows

Live chat is the front‑door channel for most Kiwi players. While no operator advertises an exact average, public feedback and editorial observation suggest that a response within two to five minutes is typical for tier‑one operators. When a promotion is launched or a major payment processor experiences downtime, those windows can stretch to ten or fifteen minutes. The operator profiles in the table above note whether live chat runs 24/7 or only during extended daytime hours; for anyone who plays late at night, that single detail often decides the account. For more context, see spin city casino.

Email and Ticket Systems

Email support is still the default for document submission and formal complaints. In a well‑organised profile, you will find a dedicated upload link for KYC documents and a ticket number you can reference in any follow‑up call. Resolution times for email range widely: straightforward verification queries can be closed in under four hours, while a dispute over bonus wagering may take several working days. The operators that handle email fastest tend to have in‑house compliance teams rather than outsourced third‑party helpdesks, a detail occasionally visible in the job‑listings section of a corporate site. This is picked up again in the galactic wins casino page.

Account Setup: The Registration Fields You’ll Encounter

Opening an account at any of the profiled sites follows a similar sequence, yet the number of mandatory fields and the point at which identity verification arrives differ substantially. Below is the typical flow you will face, drawn from the publicly viewable registration pages of the ten operators. Every site asks for an email, a password, a mobile number, and your date of birth; the variation begins after that. The same operators are compared from a different angle in the online slots NZ page.

Basic Personal Details

All operators require full legal name, residential address, and a valid phone number. Some ask for a secondary contact method, such as an alternative email, while others stop at the essentials. The address you enter must match the document you later submit for verification; discrepancies, even a missing apartment number, routinely trigger a manual review that adds twenty‑four to seventy‑two hours to the process. What happens when something goes wrong is covered in our Apple Pay rundown.

Verification Documents

Know‑your‑customer (KYC) checks are universal, but the trigger point varies. Some operators require documents before your first deposit; most allow you to deposit and play, then request a copy of your passport, driver’s licence or utility bill when you initiate a withdrawal. The table earlier indicates the typical verification window for each profile. As a rule, operators that have been in the market longer tend to process self‑uploaded documents faster, often within twelve hours on a weekday. What happens when something goes wrong is covered in the Bitcoin casinos guide.

Time to First Deposit

From landing on the sign‑up page to having a funded account, the fastest path takes about four minutes if you use instant bank transfer or a stored e‑wallet. If you choose a method that requires manual bank‑side approval, the process can extend to an hour. The operator profiles list the deposit methods that carry zero processing fees, a detail worth checking, especially if you plan to use POLi, a service still widely favoured by Kiwi users. What happens when something goes wrong is covered in skycity casino Auckland.

Official Site Verification and Identity Checks

An official site is not just the domain name but the verified landing page where you can confirm the operator’s regulatory standing. Every profile on this page links to the operator’s primary domain, where a click on the footer should reveal licence details. In the New Zealand market, many operators still hold licences from offshore bodies such as the Malta Gaming Authority or the Curaçao Gaming Control Board, a situation that will change once the local Online Casino Gambling Bill is fully implemented in 2026. Deposit limits decide what the withdrawal minimums mean in practice: the 5 dollar deposit casino page.

To avoid cloned sites, always type the URL directly or use a bookmark that matches the address shown in the operator profile. Before you enter a single personal detail, check for the padlock icon in the browser bar and confirm the SSL certificate is issued to the exact domain you intend to visit. The safest online casino NZ operators display their licence number in the footer together with a link to the regulator’s public register, where you can independently verify the licence status. This step takes thirty seconds and is the single most effective defence against phishing pages. The cost of play is broken down in our play free pokies comparison.

How Operators Differ Once You Strip Away the Marketing

When the welcome‑bonus banners and “award‑winning” badges are removed, the ten operators separate along three practical axes: how they handle player funds during withdrawal, whether their game lobby contains genuine exclusives or merely white‑label reskins, and the granularity of their responsible‑gambling controls. For “what NZ online casino is best for slots?”, see the dedicated page.

Withdrawal Processing Windows

The time an operator takes between your withdrawal request and the moment funds leave its control can range from under one hour to three full business days. Faster processing is not always better; an operator that batch‑processes withdrawals every four hours may be more reliable than one that advertises “instant” but then flags every payment for manual review. The operator profiles note whether the pending period can extend on weekends, a detail that often catches players who cash out on a Friday evening. What a fixed deposit buys at each operator is compared in our Trustpilot NZ rundown.

Game Provider Exclusivity

A handful of the profiled operators invest in exclusive pokies or branded live dealer environments. These exclusives are usually built by a mainstream provider under a revenue‑share agreement, meaning the maths and RTP are independently tested. When you see an exclusive title, ask yourself whether it genuinely adds value: a reskin of a 95% RTP slot with the operator’s logo contributes little; a dedicated blackjack table with side‑bet rules unique to that site offers a tangible difference. What a fixed deposit buys at each operator is compared in online pokies NZ.

Bonus Wagering Nuances

Every profile includes a headline welcome offer, but the real cost sits in the wagering requirements and game‑weighting tables. Typical New Zealand bonuses carry a 30x to 40x play‑through on the bonus amount, with pokies contributing 100% and table games often weighted at 5–10%. Some operators exclude live dealer play entirely; others cap the maximum bet you can place while a bonus is active. Reading the bonus terms before you accept the offer is not optional if you ever intend to withdraw winnings derived from bonus funds. Offers that need no deposit at all are compared in our best online casino NZ free spins no deposit comparison.

Which Profile Matches Your Playing Style?

The operator you choose should align with your session behaviour, not with the size of the welcome banner. Below, the ten profiles are grouped into four player segments based on the attributes that matter most outside of marketing copy.

The High‑Volume Slots Player

If you spin 500 or more rounds per session and value variety above all else, you need a catalogue with thousands of pokies and a provider list that covers both established studios and indie developers. Operators like RocketPlay and Slotsdj, whose lobbies lean heavily into slots, tend to offer filtering by volatility, RTP, or feature, saving you from scrolling through hundreds of identical layouts. Look for a profile that mentions monthly new releases and a dedicated “new games” shelf; that signals the operator actively maintains its library rather than letting it stagnate. Welcome packages across these operators are compared in our best online casino bonus NZ comparison.

The Live Dealer Enthusiast

For someone who plays blackjack, roulette or baccarat with a real dealer, the critical metric is not the total number of live tables but the variety of stake ranges and the presence of dedicated NZ‑friendly hours. Spin Casino and Royal Panda, for example, typically offer tables that open at midday CET across to late evening, which maps well to New Zealand afternoons and nights. Verify that the operator streams tables in high definition and supports a chat function that the dealer actually reads; the live casino experience collapses without that interaction.

The Casual Mobile User

Mobile players often deposit smaller amounts and play in ten‑minute bursts. For you, the best mobile online casino NZ options provide a browser‑based interface that loads quickly on 4G, a simplified cashier, and pokies optimised for portrait mode. The operator profiles highlight whether a site has a dedicated app or strictly uses progressive web app technology; neither is inherently superior, but an app may store session tokens more reliably on older devices.

The Bonus Hunter

If you move between operators to claim sign‑up offers, you will be most affected by the fine print. Profiles with lower wagering requirements and higher bet caps while a bonus is active are naturally more favourable. However, the operators that cater to this segment often impose strict maximum‑win‑from‑bonus limits, sometimes capping cash‑out at $100 even if your bonus balance reached $1,500. The table earlier notes which operators publish these caps transparently in their promotional terms. The cost of play is broken down in our Christchurch casino online pokies rundown.

Payment Methods: How the Profiles Compare

All ten operators accept Visa and Mastercard, but the supporting cast of e‑wallets, prepaid vouchers, and bank‑transfer services differs. The table below groups the commonly available methods and highlights the associated processing characteristics, drawn from the operators’ public banking pages. None of the figures are verified measurements; they reflect the information operators themselves publish and the typical behaviour reported by players. For what is available before funding an account, see the no deposit bonus casino guide.

Note that the operator that processes withdrawals the fastest is not necessarily the one with the highest headline payout rate. A site that batches payments once per day may still deliver funds within twenty‑four hours of approval, while an “instant” processor can stall for days if it flags your account for manual review. The operator profiles indicate whether weekend withdrawals are processed or held until Monday, a distinction that can turn a forty‑eight‑hour wait into a five‑day gap. Whether a newer operator is worth the risk is covered in best new online casino NZ.

Game Libraries: Separating Quantity from Quality

A lobby that boasts 10,000 games sounds impressive until you realise that 6,000 of them are slight variants of the same pokie with different background art. What counts is the number of unique game engines and the presence of titles that carry independently audited RTP certificates. The question “what NZ online casino is best for high rollers?” gets a full answer of its own.

Slots (Pokies) Catalogues

The pokies collection is the centrepiece of every NZ‑facing profile. Among the ten operators, most carry between 1,500 and 5,000 distinct slot titles, with the larger lobbies feeding from aggregator platforms that pull in releases from 70+ small studios. For players who want to know what NZ online casino is best for slots, the answer often lies in the filtering tools: operators that let you sort by volatility, payline count, and theme save you far more time than a raw catalogue count can suggest. A shortlist of five titles that match your risk profile is worth more than a thousand you will never open. For what is available before funding an account, see the king billy casino no deposit bonus page.

Table Games and Live Dealer

Outside of pokies, the table‑game section of a profile reveals how seriously an operator treats classic casino games. Sites that offer multiple blackjack variants with different side bets, European and American roulette, and baccarat squeezes demonstrate a commitment beyond the minimum. The live dealer subsection is even more telling: a profile that lists dedicated NZ‑time tables, local‑language dealers, and game‑show hybrids such as Crazy Time or Monopoly Live suggests the operator is investing in ongoing entertainment, not just ticking a box.

Mobile Access: What the Profiles Really Mean

Nearly every profile claims to be “fully mobile‑optimised,” but the experience varies from a lightweight browser client that loads in three seconds on 4G to a heavy‑duty HTML5 portal that struggles without Wi‑Fi. The table below summarises what the operator’s own mobile landing page typically promises versus the practical reality reported by players. The cost of play is broken down in our royal Vegas comparison.

Where a dedicated app exists, it can deliver push notifications for new bonuses and provide a persistent login token that reduces the friction of two‑factor prompts. However, an app is only as good as its update cycle; if an operator’s app store listing shows the last update twelve months ago, the browser version is likely more current. The cost of play is broken down in our leovegas NZ rundown.

Bonus Structures and Wagering Conditions

Every profile in the top‑rated list carries a welcome bonus, but the real comparison lives in the terms. A large NZ$ bonus figure can be neutralised by a 50x wagering requirement that attaches to both the bonus and the deposit, a condition Kiwi players call “sticky.” The operators profiled here tend to fall into two camps: those that prioritise a larger headline figure with moderate play‑through, and those that offer a smaller sum with faster clearing. The cost of play is broken down in our jackpot city NZ comparison.

Welcome Offers and Free Spins

A typical NZ welcome package spans one to four deposits, matching your first deposit by 100% and adding a bundle of free spins on a featured pokie. The spins usually carry their own wagering requirement, often 35x the winnings derived from them, and expire within seven days. Check whether the spins are released all at once or drip‑fed over several days; the latter keeps you logging in but may force you to wager winnings in smaller, less efficient chunks. Recently launched sites are assessed separately in our new online casinos NZ rundown.

Ongoing Promotions and Wagering

Beyond the welcome, the operator’s monthly promotion calendar reveals its attitude toward loyalty. Some profiles feature weekly reload bonuses, cashback on live dealer losses, and prize‑draw tickets for leaderboard competitions. The most transparent operators publish the exact contribution weight of each game type to the wagering requirement; a blackjack session may count only 5%, meaning you would need to wager twenty times your bonus amount on blackjack to clear the same obligation that one pokie spin would clear. The cost of play is broken down in our Christchurch casino online comparison.

Responsible Gambling Tools per Operator

Every operator profiled is required to offer responsible‑gambling controls, but the granularity varies. The table below lists the tools commonly encountered and notes which profiles include advanced features such as net‑loss limits or session‑time counters.

Profiles that build these controls into the account dashboard, rather than burying them in a responsible‑gambling page, make it easier to set limits at the moment you need them. Several operators on this page also provide direct links to external help organisations such as the New Zealand Gambling Helpline. The cost of play is broken down in spinz.

• Deposit limits can usually be tightened instantly but take twenty‑four hours or more to loosen, a deliberate friction designed to prevent impulsive decisions.
• Session timers are most effective when the operator sends a push notification rather than a silent in‑page banner you might ignore.
• Self‑exclusion across multiple brands is still a developing feature in the NZ market; only a few profiles participate in shared exclusion databases.

Reading Between the Lines: Common Profile Red Flags

An operator profile can look flawless on the surface and still contain warning signs that experienced players learn to spot. Below are the five most frequent red flags visible on the page itself, before you ever deposit. Each one is drawn from the kinds of information operators publish voluntarily, not from insider testing. Wagering is what decides an offer's real value — our best casino bonus NZ rundown compares the terms side by side.

• Licence details that link to a generic information page rather than a searchable register.
• Game‑weighting tables that hide low contribution percentages in tiny footnotes.
• Withdrawal policies that list a “management review” step without specifying its maximum duration.
• Customer‑support hours that change across different sections of the site.
• Welcome‑bonus terms that do not disclose a maximum cash‑out in the same paragraph as the bonus amount.

When one of these signals appears, pause and open the operator’s live chat. Ask a direct question about the specific term. If the agent deflects or points you back to the generic terms page without answering, treat that as a red flag in its own right. A safe online casino NZ operator will have support staff who can clarify a term in plain English within a few minutes.

Final Checklist: Choosing an Operator That Fits

Before you register, run through the five questions below. They synthesise every profile element discussed on this page into a practical decision tool. The operators detailed in the main comparison table all clear the baseline safety bar; your task is to find the one that aligns tightly with your habits. What a fixed deposit buys at each operator is compared in the wheelz casino page.

1. Does the operator accept a payment method you already use, with no extra fees on either side? A deposit method that works for your bank or e‑wallet eliminates one variable.
2. Is the live dealer schedule compatible with your usual playing time? If you play after 10 p.m. NZT, you need tables that are open and staffed.
3. What is the documented verification window for a first withdrawal? Assume it will take the longer end of the stated range, and plan your first cash‑out accordingly.
4. Do the pokies you love appear in the lobby, and can you filter by provider? A search box that returns partial results is a sign of a poorly maintained catalogue.
5. Are responsible‑gambling controls reachable in two taps from the main lobby? If you have to dig through a footer menu every time you want to check your session, the friction will discourage you from using them.

How the Operator Profiles Relate to Wider NZ Gambling Trends

New Zealand online betting sites operate in a legal environment that is about to change fundamentally. The Online Casino Gambling Bill, which received royal assent in May 2026, will introduce a domestic licensing system for up to fifteen operators, bringing offshore‑licensed platforms under local oversight. The operators profiled on this page currently hold licences from offshore bodies, but all will eventually need to transition if they wish to continue serving New Zealand players after the licensing window closes. For a detailed timeline of the regulatory changes, consult the legislation tracker section of this site. The smallest workable deposits are compared in our $1 deposit casino NZ rundown.

This shift makes it more important than ever to understand who runs a site before you commit funds. An operator that has already published its intention to seek a New Zealand licence sends a different signal than one that remains silent on the matter. While none of the profiles can yet show a domestic licence number, you can look for mentions of the Department of Internal Affairs in a site’s corporate blog or press releases. An operator that is preparing for compliance will often adjust its responsible‑gambling tools and verification procedures ahead of the deadline, changes that directly benefit players today. What a fixed deposit buys at each operator is compared in our casumo casino rundown.

The average Kiwi punter funds a casino account with NZ$50–$200 per month, so a few hours spent reading operator profiles pays off over hundreds of future sessions. As the online gambling NZ market matures, the gap between operators that invest in genuine player infrastructure and those that rely on marketing gloss will widen. The information on this page is meant to help you stay on the informed side of that divide.

Profile Depth: What a Single Operator Paragraph Tells You

Take one profile from the master table and read it as you would a restaurant review. The first thing to notice is not the star rating but the year of establishment. A site that has been live since 2018 has survived multiple regulatory cycles and has a track record of paying players; a site launched in 2022 may still be building its operational reserves. Next, look at the payment‑method count. An operator that offers fifteen methods is likely integrated with multiple acquiring banks, which means a single processor outage is less likely to halt all deposits. When you see an operator that supports POLi alongside Visa, Skrill and MuchBetter, it signals an understanding of the New Zealand banking landscape that a generic international site may lack. If the entry cost matters more than the offer size, minimum deposit $1 get $20 NZ ranks the same sites by it.

The game‑lobby description in a profile is often the most inflated figure on the page. A lobby of “10,000 games” usually includes every regional variant of a single pokie, every live dealer table language option, and every demo slot. To get a realistic count, filter the games tab by provider and count the unique titles that appear. If an operator claims a large catalogue but three‑quarters of the pokies come from a single aggregator, the variety you experience may be narrower than the number suggests. The profiles in the comparison table have been grouped by catalogue breadth after applying that real‑world lens, so you can see at a glance where each site sits. What a fixed deposit buys at each operator is compared in our PayPal casino NZ rundown.

What the Future NZ Licensing Means for These Profiles

The New Zealand government intends to issue the first domestic licences in early 2027, with a cut‑off date of 1 December 2026 by which operators must have submitted an application. For Kiwi players, this means the operator profiles you see today will likely gain a new footer line: a New Zealand licence number issued by the Department of Internal Affairs. Until then, the best online casino payouts advice remains straightforward: choose a site that is publicly preparing for the transition, because that preparation invariably tightens its operational standards across the board.

Some of the profiled operators have already published “expression of interest” statements in their corporate news sections, a detail you can verify in under a minute. Others are waiting for the auction phase later in 2026. The operator that moves first is not always the best, but it does show a willingness to subject itself to local rules. As a player, you can treat that willingness as an additional trust signal, alongside the licence, audit seals and responsible‑gambling tools. The full shortlist these figures come from is on the best online casino NZ overview.

How to Use This Page Over Time

Bookmark the operator‑profile table and revisit it every few months. As the licensing deadline approaches, operators will update their terms, add domestic payment methods, and possibly adjust their game libraries to comply with local regulations. The best online casino NZ real money experience in October 2026 may look different from the one you see today, not because the sites have changed their name, but because the legislative backdrop has shifted. When a Kiwi site updates its responsible‑gambling page to reference the New Zealand Gambling Act 2003, you can be fairly certain other operational tweaks are underway.

For those who primarily play casino games like blackjack or roulette, the profiles that invest in dedicated NZ‑time tables will become increasingly valuable as the market formalises. Similarly, the best online casino NZ fast withdrawal operators will likely be those that already process payments through local banking rails, minimising the international correspondent delays that can add two extra days to a cash‑out. Pair the information here with the deposit and payout rankings found elsewhere on the site for a complete picture.

Anyone who asks what NZ online casino is best for high rollers should also watch the maximum withdrawal limits that appear in the operator profiles. As sites prepare for local licensing, some have raised their monthly cash‑out caps to accommodate higher‑value play, while others have kept conservative limits that suit the mass market. If you intend to move larger sums through an account, confirm the cap directly with support before you deposit.

Operator Profiles for the Sports Betting Cross‑Over Player

While this page focuses on casino profiles, a significant number of Kiwi users split their time between pokies and sports betting. Several of the operators listed also run a sportsbook under the same licence, a detail noted in their profile. The integration can be seamless: a single wallet funds both sides, and loyalty points earned on slots can sometimes be used toward a sport bet on the NRL or Super Rugby. For players who want to know the best sports betting sites nz, the cross‑operator wallet is a convenience feature worth checking in the profile before you commit to a dual‑purpose account.

Online poker enthusiasts will find that some profiles include a poker room, though it is rarely the headline offering. If online poker is your primary interest, look for an operator whose profile mentions dedicated poker software and regular tournament schedules. The operators that run shared liquidity pools with international networks can offer larger guarantees, but they may also route you through a separate client download, which changes the mobile experience.

Summary: The Operator Behind the Logo

Every bet you place, every pokie spin you trigger, and every live dealer hand you play runs on an operator’s infrastructure. The ten profiles collected on this page are not ranked by a single score; they are described in the kind of detail that lets you decide what matters for your own sessions. Use the comparison table to narrow the field, then open the live chat of your top candidate and ask the one question you care about most. The quality of that single answer often reveals more than a hundred review paragraphs ever could.

In 2026, New Zealand is at a turning point for online gambling, and the operators that survive the licensing transition will be those that have built their profiles on transparent terms, responsive support, and gaming catalogues that are maintained rather than just marketed. The information on this page is a starting point. Combine it with the detailed deposit, payout, and game guides elsewhere on the site, and you will have everything you need to open an account with both eyes open.